Forums - A3 against Dhalsim Show all 29 posts from this thread on one page Forums (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/index.php) - Strategy & Tactics (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?forumid=10) -- A3 against Dhalsim (http://www.shoryuken.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=51412) Posted by sabotender on 01:10:2002 07:33 PM: A3 against Dhalsim What are some good characters and techniques to use against Dhalsim players in A3? Posted by coco savage on 01:10:2002 10:23 PM: Dhali ownz fool. Just use V-sak dude, she beats it all!!! Posted by Mouko on 01:11:2002 12:44 AM: The easiest person to use against Sim is Akuma. Particularly Vism Akuma. He has a lot of tricks and can get in on Sim quick. I hope you know or at least heard of the OTG Vism. That's AKuma's biggest weapon against Sim. You can do about 80% damage and he cannot flip out of it. The basic gameplan is to get in fast, make him eat some quick guard bar damage and he'll push you back and start over. Then you will look for an opening to OTG VC him. He has to do two different anti airs to counter AKuma's Dive kick and short HK. Mix them up. Jump in with a Dive kick -> do a few s.jabs -> then b+rh. That's the basic version. Then mix it up between jumping in with dive kicks and short HKs. Walk up jab is what you want to do a lot because the gaps are too small for him to counter. Posted by nex2me on 01:11:2002 01:35 AM: V-ism is to be feared somewhat in general. Akuma, to me, is not a big threat....now sakura..there you go. But V-ism all comes down to that meter. Any Sim player knows that, and it is not as easy as you might think to just rush Sim down. Get a good A-Sim, that can telelprot in the air as soon as Akuma get close and zone the hell out of em. That dive kick is really not a big threat because a simple jump up back then down and spear, with the right timing and Sim wins more than not. I will admit that the OTG is dangerous, along with Sakura's full screen. But really it comes down to the player. Sim's standing jab beats alot for anit-air attacks. JMO Posted by mondu_the_fat on 01:11:2002 02:25 AM: Re: A3 against Dhalsim quote: Originally posted by sabotender What are some good characters and techniques to use against Dhalsim players in A3? I prefer V-Gief, and second-guess Dhalsim. Zangief has numerous anti-sim moves, but they're very specific (Body Splash, knees, crouching JP are some moves than can beat sim, but only if your time/space them right). Frankly, I think the only reason why I win using Gief is because I'm also very familiar with Sim and very few people can handle V-gief well. For example, if you manage to jump in on Dhalsim they will try to anti-air with either standing JP or SP -- which means they're vulnerable to a VC. The tactics of keep-away that they'd use against V-Akuma they seem to forget when they fight Gief. Any-Rose (with her crouching SP) can handle Sim. Any-Rolento also (crouching JP, ability to cross the screen quickly, guard pressure). V-Akuma, too (combos, guard pressure), but he has a hard time, IMHO. Surprisingly, Any-Ken (jump-in hurricane ?!). V-Sak (pokes). X-Ryu (damage). Any-Chun-li (cross-up Sk to throw -- more ticks than a dog). But As next2me pointed out, Sim matches boils down to the player. Posted by Mouko on 01:11:2002 05:25 AM: Quote Nex2me quote: Akuma, to me, is not a big threat....now sakura..there you go. But V-ism all comes down to that meter. That is true with any Ism...Meter dependecy is not a factor, it's about who has the best ways of getting in vs dhalsim, and Akuma is more ways than one (unlike Sakura) quote: Get a good A-Sim, that can telelprot in the air as soon as Akuma get close I would like to see this. There is no room to air teleport if akuma is in your face and jumping with short HKs. If you jump in the air and try to teleport, he's going to nail you or force you to block it. quote: That dive kick is really not a big threat because a simple jump up back then down and spear, with the right timing and Sim wins more than not. Like I said..if you mix up Akuma's jump in, Dhalsim has to pretty much "predict" what Akuma is going to do. If Dhalsim guesses wrong he'll eat a Hk. Btw, Dive kicks are usually done close enough so that it prevents Sim from even being able to jump. Once Akuma gets dive kick, he gets free jabs. quote: I will admit that the OTG is dangerous, along with Sakura's full screen. But really it comes down to the player. Sim's standing jab beats alot for anit-air attacks. Sakura is less of a threat because she has a harder time getting in. She has to inch her way foward, throw random c.strongs. Jump in far with short. Jump in close with rh. Then go for s.jabs -> b+fierce -> fb and start over. Good thing is Sim cannot teleport out of her VC, because she can reset the damage. But she has less options than akuma of getting in. She doesn't have demon flip like akuma (which you can throw out once in a while to get in) or to a lesser extent, teleport. Of course the players skill is a factor..but that's in any match. comparing how a character does against a character is based on the moves they have, not the players abilities. Posted by Apoc on 01:11:2002 12:21 PM: Against A-Sim A-Chun is best imo. Against X-sim use X-rogand his cr.strong heheh. X-rog ownz X-sim for free. Apoc. Posted by aCme on 01:11:2002 04:28 PM: i have one question regarding sim, can someone explain the game mechanics behind sim being able to escape certain (non-sim proof) vc's. I know that there are certain situations where sim can tp out of combos, but I don't understand why that is. Why can sim escape using tp's but other characters can't flip. Is he allowed to tp before the opponent reaches a neutral state? Thanks to anyone who sheds some light on this one. -a Posted by Mouko on 01:11:2002 09:16 PM: It's a special property of A and V sim. Xism Sim cannot teleport out of a VC. It's not done like a regular teleport, rather, it's done by doing an alpha 2 style alpha counter with kick. He can teleport out of any AIR JUGGLE VC, but there are a few exceptions (see bottom) b, d/b, d + kick. There are situations where sim Doesn't want to tele out of a VC, such as Sakura or if he's being corner juggled, because he teleports right in front of them and has recovery, allowing the VCer to reset the VC for more damage. And there are some cases where he cannot teleport at all, if he's being VCed on the ground (Ryu corner VC) and some special VCs. Such as BAS Akuma OTG VC and Gief Glitch Driver VC. Posted by sykocrashaa on 01:11:2002 11:56 PM: All I know is that when I used my V-Sim in A3, I REALLY had a hard time against Rose... like mondu_the_fat said, its because of her damn crouching SP. Posted by TS on 01:12:2002 03:52 AM: quote: Originally posted by sykocrashaa All I know is that when I used my V-Sim in A3, I REALLY had a hard time against Rose... like mondu_the_fat said, its because of her damn crouching SP. You have to get closer to her... As you probably found out, most of Sim's long distance moves lose to crouching Strong. Try to get closer to her and use your drills (good, unless you get predictable...Soul Throw/Super/CC combo, whatever), and your crouching kicks. The drills (Forward and Roundhouse) are hard to punish on reaction, because they trade/beat most of Rose's normals, and the slides on the ground go under her crouching Strong. I lost a match to Jason Cole's A-Sim with my Rose...wish I could rewatch it somehow, because I didn't make any huge mistakes or anything...oh well... Posted by KINGDOM on 01:12:2002 08:27 AM: on an almost unrelated note...Apoc, you gave a great performance on the B5 dvd man...much respect on your A-Chun Li. Posted by Hoogie on 01:12:2002 08:30 AM: Sakura strats? I've been learning V-Sak, and I've kind of plateaued with her. What are some good poking patterns for her? Generally, how is she best played? What exactly is the timing like for her full screen VC? I always either short spinkick past them or do it too late. Ugh. Thanks! Posted by nex2me on 01:12:2002 09:07 PM: Hey Apoc, do not doubt your Balrog skills. I would luv to take you on in a few matches with my X-sim. Come on over to NY... Thing is all this talk about pressuring Sim, and as I see it Sim can pressure with the best of 'em. I will say that Rolento, Chun got that poke thang on Sim. And Giefs splash, if used correctly is a beeach. And Rose, it was not untill recently that I played a Rose that made me step back and say, Shit...her high heels hurt...lol I play against Cen's A-Sim and he has a poke that just has to be seen. Sim can control the screen on so many levels. There are charecters that can get across the screen very quickly... but in Sim's case his limbs are already there. And it is just a matter of throwing them out there at the right time. I know that sounds silly, but the space that you can create is kind of like a triangle. i.e standing short, crouching MP/FP, standing MK/HK. Throw in a Healthy does of FB and flames and you got yourself a nice little thing going. There is obviously more to it than that, but I do not think that there is any other charecter that I use every button. I mean there are some cherecters that you can just use 3 maybe 4 buttons and have no worries. That is one of the reasons that why I had a bad taste in my mouth in CvS. Sim, IMO, is just not a 4 button man. Maybe in MvC2.. I have seen some good Sims there. Anyway...backto the matter at hand...If and one play Kaillera on line maybe we can get some rounds going.... Posted by mondu_the_fat on 01:16:2002 08:47 AM: TS: "...slides on the ground go under the strong" Rose and Sim. Reminds of of one time I went to this little arcade. The locals playing Z3 probably never even looked at what V-ism could do, but it was still a good find because there was an unusually large amount Z3 players there. I played X-sim and kicked the holy crap out of them (amidst all of the whispers on how cheap X-Sim was). Finally, their local "expert" said something to the effect of "I'm tired of this, I'm using Z-Rose". His friends cheered, then I proceeded to bully Rose around with nothing but SK slides. He couldn't do anything. I wanted to laugh out loud but I figured they were pissed enough as it was. Shit, I'm so small and petty sometimes... Posted by kenzo42 on 01:16:2002 09:17 AM: why don't we get a SFA3 tournament going on for the o.g. alpha 3 playahs. all i see are cvs2 tournaments now =( anyone interested? this post probably doesn't belong in this forum. kenzo Posted by Ken34 on 01:16:2002 04:21 PM: Just use someone that is quick and can use far away attacks like Ken or Shin Akuma or even Bison at times. Posted by Soyo[u] on 01:16:2002 08:02 PM: In Japan now there are very few Dhalsim but we still have a strong variety of character used. IMO, An expert Zangief can beat a Dhalsim, also, Japan Gouki (Akuma US) has a very strong chance of pressuring Dhalsim as Mouko have said. Expert Chun-li can do well against an amateur Dhalsim, but expert dhalsim can kill her very easily. Her moves have very strong priority but if the Dhalsim play good keep away games then she is easily killed. I watch the b5 DVD and I think the americans are very good in many games, including Alpha 3, but they need to learn more about Vism combos. I really think Thao Dhalsim is strong and Danny is very good. Ricky Ortiz Sakura is basic but strong. John Choi is very good as well. Tony Sakura seem very sloppy and does weak Vism Combos. In the beginning I saw Apoc vs BAS and Apoc kept getting rushed and guard break but did nothing. He says he was thinking of a flashy combo, but I don't get what that means because Chun li does not have any flashy combo. She is very basic but strong. Maki is a very famous Chun li player here and she does very well, if you watch the beat tribe video (which I believe they sold at B5) you can see her and her team play Chun-li. I think Apoc should watch the video. In reply to Nex2Me, Rolento is not very effective unless played very skillfully. He cannot do standing jab a lot because Dhalsim can counter with crouching fierce. As I have said before, Chun-li is easily beaten if the Dhalsim knows how to fight her. Posted by Temujin on 01:16:2002 11:53 PM: Sakura jump roundhouse nuff' said. Posted by Temujin on 01:16:2002 11:57 PM: quote: Originally posted by Soyo[u] Tony Sakura seem very sloppy and does weak Vism Combos. In the beginning I saw Apoc vs BAS and Apoc kept getting Are you talking about me ? Tony Lentzakis (Canada) I didn't know I was on the B5 DVD... But I agree my V-Ism wasn't as tight then... Posted by Soyo[u] on 01:17:2002 07:35 AM: Sorry for the mistake. I got video footage online mixed up with dvd footage. I remember seeing Tony Temujin Sakura video against Liquid Metal V Sodom. Sakura was very sloppy I hope you improve your gameplay. Posted by TS on 01:17:2002 08:42 AM: Soyou- what do you think of V-ISM Rose then? Not vs Dhalsim (though comments are welcome...), just in general. I hear she gets played over in Japan, but I think I'm seriously the only person in North America who plays her. Posted by master ken on 01:17:2002 09:47 AM: quote: Originally posted by Soyo[u] Sorry for the mistake. I got video footage online mixed up with dvd footage. I remember seeing Tony Temujin Sakura video against Liquid Metal V Sodom. Sakura was very sloppy I hope you improve your gameplay. Tony sucks, he needs more practice lol Seriously, Tony is a very skilled player, I think he's the #1 A3 player in Canada. You can't judge him after watching only one match. It was B5 and I think it was the first time he got to play a skilled Japanese player; therefore, I think he was a little bit nervous and rusty, I'm sure he wasn't playing at 100 %. I usually play against him, and believe me, his V-combos are sick, it takes off more than 50% of my life bar. Besides, his game play is also great, he can mix up his attacks, and confuse you with all sort of tricks. Alright !! enough ass kissing I'm sure Tony can defend him self better than I do. Posted by savio78 on 01:17:2002 10:22 PM: is there X-dhalsim and V-Zangief footage on the b5 dvd?and which characters did the dhalsim players lost to? Posted by Soyo[u] on 01:17:2002 11:30 PM: TS: I believe Rose is a good overall player, she is good in all ISM, Zism and Vism she is very strong. Her Xism super is very strong as well. She has a lot of good Vism Combos. But I believe her problem is that she is weaker than she was in Zero 2. Her crouching fierce is weaker than in Zero 2. She can be very strong like any other character in Vism. In Japan, we have players that use all different characters, even juni and juli! Master Ken: I know people can improve when they are in a tournament and see many new things. I hope Tony has been practicing! Posted by Temujin on 01:18:2002 01:08 AM: Don't worry I improved alot, I don't play the way you saw in that video now.. My VC's have maximum damage and I end with crouch cancels with give me back 40% of my VC bar.. The thing is my Sakura is kinda self-taught.. I played my own style and I only learned how to really play her effectively after going to B5 and the other major tourneys in the summer. I still play Alpha 3 and tell BAS I hope to play him again soon.. See ya Posted by nex2me on 01:20:2002 05:04 PM: OK I think that we can all agree that everygame boils down to each individual person's excution of their charecter. With that said.... quote: Originally posted by Ken34 Just use someone that is quick and can use far away attacks like Ken or Shin Akuma or even Bison at times. Out of these three Akuma and Bison have a much better chance than Ken. Qucikness does not play as big a part overall as does the charecters. Chun, Guy, Sakura all relatively quick charecters. Do they gaurantee a victory, by no means. Like Soyo or Apoc said a good 'Gief or Balrog can give Sim problems, and we all know that they are not the fastest charecters. Rolento can give Sim some problems, if only for the fact that his stick pokes with the best of 'em, has grest range, and alot of priority. Posted by Ken34 on 01:22:2002 04:49 PM: quote: Originally posted by nex2me OK I think that we can all agree that everygame boils down to each individual person's excution of their charecter. With that said.... Out of these three Akuma and Bison have a much better chance than Ken. Qucikness does not play as big a part overall as does the charecters. Chun, Guy, Sakura all relatively quick charecters. Do they gaurantee a victory, by no means. Like Soyo or Apoc said a good 'Gief or Balrog can give Sim problems, and we all know that they are not the fastest charecters. Rolento can give Sim some problems, if only for the fact that his stick pokes with the best of 'em, has grest range, and alot of priority. You do have a point, it deos boil down to who uses who best, but if a begginner started playing the game, he would be better off with a simple character like Ken or Akuma. Bison is a little bit more teqnicle to figure out. It took me a while to master him, and I still can't really beat everyone in vs mode with him. Posted by nex2me on 01:23:2002 02:41 PM: Very true, 'Sim is not a pick up and go charecter. Not that he is on some unattainable level....lol, just that control of the limbs and using them effectively and winning whew...tooo much....lol. Even though I started out with Ryu, and he is still my favorite shoto. All times are GMT. The time now is 12:15 AM. Show all 29 posts from this thread on one page Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.2.4 Copyright © Jelsoft Enterprises Limited 2000, 2001.